Curse

Flameseeker · Aug 21, 2011, 01:43 PM // 13:43

Just to clear a bit from what i said before.
I didn't want to imply SoS or discord are the best builds out there.

SoS might be easier to learn compared to SoGM since he can make his spirits last longer. That way he might be able to pay more attention to positioning and learn the timing for each situation, which he should work before some skills that require a little more to manage.

Discord is just a skill that provides a huge bar compression. That has the only damaging skill can spike down targets easily, while the rest of the bar can be used for utility purposes, be it minions/hexes/heals.

There are other more effective solutions, and with the mercs now you have even more freedom to abuse the strengths of each profession (though thei're not required for anything), but discord is just a lazy easy mode since you can just think a little about pulling and positioning in the more difficult areas.

Don't know if you already read something about zaishen elite, but it's quite easy to get there 6k faction/day and use it to unlock skills. I wouldn't bother unlocking elites unless it's absolutely necessary. You'll probably try legendary skill hunter so you'll unlock them all.

Another advice, you might have noticed something about that already, is that melee heroes AI is just awful compared to caster heroes (and those have some problems too).

One last thing is don't focus only on healing, in NM that might be fine in most cases but your team will just get stomped in HM.
Prot is a great way to keep yourself safe, a Soul Twist/Shelter Rit can keep you alive through difficult enemies spikes. And if you bring a monk with you, you can use protective spirit in yourself to grab agro while distanced from your team, preventing disastrous spikes that would take your team down in seconds.

Good luck in adventures and try to learn from your mistakes, even older players still learn a thing or two no matter how good they are.

Elfblade · Aug 21, 2011, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flameseeker

Just to clear a bit from what i said before.
I didn't want to imply SoS or discord are the best builds out there.

SoS might be easier to learn compared to SoGM since he can make his spirits last longer. That way he might be able to pay more attention to positioning and learn the timing for each situation, which he should work before some skills that require a little more to manage.

I picked the wrong words i guess to suggest the sogm as a player bar.
another try: i think both are great options and offer the same value as a player in a hero team. i just think that the sogm can be better kept up by a human player and you have acces to summon spirits to heal and tp them (as they have a long recharge and higher cost). I think both offer the same learning value as you said he can just poop down the spirits and pay attention to his surroundings both builds offer that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flameseeker

Discord is just a skill that provides a huge bar compression. That has the only damaging skill can spike down targets easily, while the rest of the bar can be used for utility purposes, be it minions/hexes/heals.

i dont want to turn this thread into a discord discussion but in the current era of 7 heroes bar compression is needed less and less. looking at what the discord backline has to offer you can have the same with 1 ded healer and 1 hybrid type. maybe he should try it, but in my opinion it will teach him nothing about positioning and tactics as it is just c-space. anyway this is as far i go as the discord suggestion.(we have been there and done that, there are more than enough threads on guru)

Your suggestion on the zaishen elite is great, i totally forgot you can earn easy faction and use it to unlock the skills needed for heroes instead of going out to cap them.

afya · Aug 21, 2011, 09:37 PM // 21:37

The only thing I found WoC hard is the overlapping of petrol groups, which makes you really easy to get sandwiched or to over-aggroing 3 groups.

Longbow is a must, and don't try to ninja pass groups, they WILL come to you.

Cryshal · Aug 22, 2011, 02:39 AM // 02:39

afya, yes, those patroling groups do me in. What is maddening is to go so far and wipe, and end with -60, but I see that many players do finish with -60 because of the way you have to whittle whittle on enemy groups to get past them and on to the next whittle whittle.

ChaoticCoyote · Aug 22, 2011, 09:27 PM // 21:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cryshal

afya, yes, those patroling groups do me in. What is maddening is to go so far and wipe, and end with -60, but I see that many players do finish with -60 because of the way you have to whittle whittle on enemy groups to get past them and on to the next whittle whittle.

Consummables and holiday items.

Heck, even with overpowered heroes and mercenaries and whatever, crap happens, and I sometimes wipe. I keep various candy canes and connsumables (available from faction vendors in EoTN after your reach level 3 rep with tme).

The key, in my opinion, is to have enough skill unlock to build good heroes and mercenaries. That means buying skills, using Balthazar faction for unlocks, and capping elites. In my opinion, having the best skills unlocked is the key to the end game and hard mode.

Cryshal · Aug 22, 2011, 11:03 PM // 23:03

I have picked up all the better skills. I can't use some of the best ones because of my profession, Ranger, and Heroes can't use the elites.

I would like to know more about getting Balthazar faction, where to start, how, etc.

BenjZee · Aug 23, 2011, 02:09 AM // 02:09

Cap some of the skills anyway and it will unlock them over your account so your heroes can use them, it will also progress in your title for Skill hunter. This game has difficult parts but i wouldnt want it to be simplier, though i do advise vanquishing Cho's estate before you do WoC.
They made WiK last battle easier and that was before we could even have a full team of heroes, i say stick at it and get used to the game mechanics and diverse yourself into more builds. Your heroes being upgraded aren't essential but i have to say if you get more in to it your'll learn alot more about the different upgrades and weapons available to you.
Balthazar faction need not be got to unlock skills as there may be a lot more convenient methods, though i would look up Zaishen Elite mission in the battle isles as a really conveniant way of gaining them.

Quick note on Signet of Spirits: Somewhat lazy but you can make a pretty efficent spirit spammer on any proffesion and dude to ranger's experitse attribute they are almost as good as ritualists.

Da Kenster · Aug 23, 2011, 02:26 AM // 02:26

As the previous poster stated, the Zaishen elite is a great way to farm balthazar faction, with a cap of 6k a day. As a ranger, you can easily do this with a trapping build. With a team of players, a single run can be completed relatively fast, with henchmen it will take longer. The trick is finding a group at the right time from my experience.

Good luck to you.

Tom Swift · Aug 23, 2011, 05:06 AM // 05:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cryshal

I have picked up all the better skills. I can't use some of the best ones because of my profession, Ranger, and Heroes can't use the elites.

Forgive me if I misunderstood but when you say that heroes can't use the elites, did you mean because you have not yet capped or unlocked elites you want them to use? Or did you mean the PvE only skills?